[Balance] Class & Archetypes

Tactical Myzzrym
Level 14
Tactical Adventures Dev
Discord Link Steam Link Newsletter Link Developer Badge
1 month ago

This is the thread for balance feedback about the classes & archetypes of Solasta.

Here is a template to help you submit feedback (you don't HAVE to use it, but it helps)

  • Class: 
  • Archetype: 
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever:
  • Power: too weak / weak / balanced / strong / too strong
  • Feedback: 
  • Suggestion (if any):

Cheers!

Myzzrym

laoni
Level 3
Discord Link Kickstarter Backer Mayor's Ring (Bronze)
1 month ago (edited)

This post has been deleted.

Oinkus
Level 3
1 month ago

I can't get past the second tutorial. Gray Wolf I have hit for a maximum of 15 hp of 50 and it has one hit me 12 times in a row. An hour of dying is not my idea of balanced gaming.

PhanZero
Level 1
1 month ago

@Oinkus
Maybe you are missing something... maybe something heavy? ;) Fighting isn't the option to go for here...

(I missed this at first too, but it's a tutorial so it's okay to be required to just have a single valid option at hand, I guess)

John Allen
Level 3
1 month ago

I died 10 times before I realized that I had the action economy to Disengage and then PUSH the rock onto the bridge.
It's a tutorial designed to teach you just that. I was like, "Oh...yea, I'm dumb. I totally didn't pay attention to my action choices. Lesson learned."



PICKITUP!

1 month ago

Hi guys! Little bit of feedback here after several hours tooling around (MAN I was so hyped to finally hit 3rd level!):

  • Class: Rogue
  • Archetype: Shadowcaster (or Darkcaster? the Arcane Trickster analogue :p)
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: Spellcasting
  • Power: too weak
  • Feedback: I felt a little let down by the 1st-level spell selection for this guy. Ended up going with the Darkweaver/Assassin analogue for the +2 bonus to ranged weapon damage rolls, despite having rolled my half-elf rogue with high Intelligence, simply because it seemed more like the far superior option. The 30-foot teleport once per rest (is this short or long rest? the description didn't specify) didn't seem to compensate for the limited spell selection. I LOVE the game, though! :D
  • Suggestion (if any): Maybe just a magic missile or a thunderwave? The shield spell is super nice, but mage armor/identify/detect magic seem kind of like throwaways . . .

"I saw her first. Go find your own genetic time-capsule or so help me, I'll *cut* you."

Ragnarok
Level 6
1 month ago (edited)
  • Class: Wizard
  • Archetype: Loremaster
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: Keen Mind
  • Power: too weak
  • Feedback: Crafting anything seems to be extremely hard to do, as one character needs to have proficiency in so many different things and know a spell in order to craft something. Unless you plan for that you might not get a character who can craft anything, which makes the crafting part of the Loremaster feature basically useless. It doesn't help that the two other archetypes seem to be very powerful.
  • Suggestion (if any): 1. Allow multiple characters to help craft items OR 2. Reduce the requirements to craft items OR 3. Replace the crafting part of the feature with some combat utility like the other 2 archetypes. Example: You have studied the nature of the Weave and can manipulate it to do your bidding. Once per long rest you can cast a spell using your highest available spell slot without consuming that spell slot. Sounds powerful but Shock Arcanists can cast all war spells at one higher level every time they cast it, which is mental!

Edit: Another idea (from the discord community (Thanks View619)) is giving the subclass more (or all?) tools proficiencies. This could turn them into the crafter which is what this archetype seems to be leaning into.

Oinkus
Level 3
1 month ago

 Yeah staring at it forever did not make me any happier. I have found in my decades of running games that making only one solution to a problem is generally a bad idea. I am not a read the internet for tips but after an hour I did a search. I was running past the boulder and tried every option available. Sometimes it is just me I am sure. I have to say this game feels much more like playing D&D then BG3 does since everything you encounter does the AoE surface effects attacks from a distance.

Ragnarok
Level 6
1 month ago (edited)
  • Class: Rogue
  • Archetype: Darkweaver
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: Class theme
  • Power: Not applicable
  • Feedback: This class doesn't seem to carve out it's own niche very well. The poison proficiency and predator is ok but the Spider on Wall feature is just a poor mans Second-Story Work. I don't really have a good feel for what the class should be doing. Is it an assassin with poisons? Is it a sharpshooter? They don't really mix very well in my opinion.
  • Suggestion (if any): Focus on one thing and double down on it. Change Spider on Wall and Predator to be features much more suitable to the theme. 


Edit: Another suggestion could be leaning darkweaver into the assassin type more and let them ignore disadvantage imposed by light levels when sneaking, or something like that. Then they could fill the sneaky assassin archetype which neither of the other subclasses currently fill.

Evgeniy
Level 4
1 month ago (edited)

Figter

  • Class: fighter
  • Archetype: champion
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: useless comparing to other Archetypes
  • Power:  fighter is fighter, but crit 19-20, random, I had 5-6 critical hits on my early access, other Archetypes have benefits in every battle
  • Suggestion: change crit bonus on one more fighting style. (it will be in balance I think), or something intresting, do not beware to change 5e (it is boring=) 

Hope your game will be great. With respect, Evgeniy(Jonny). 


Evgen

1 month ago
  • Class: Fighter
  • Archetype: Champion
  • Feature: Improved Critical
  • Power: Too Weak
  • Feedback: Champion is the only real option for a dual wielding or two handed fighter with low intelligence and it is massively weak compared to Mountaineer and Spell Blade. Getting access to spellcasting is obviously powerful and scales really well so I'm going to focus more on Mountaineer vs Champion.

    Mountaineer gets +2 AC in a condition that is pretty easy to fulfill. On a shield using fighter with 21 AC (18 from armour, 1 from defense style, 2 from shield) an additional +2 AC is a massive increase in survivability.

    Attack - Hit Chance vs 20 AC - Hit Chance vs 22 AC - Difference
    +3 - 15% - 5% - x3.00
    +4 - 20% - 10% - x2.00
    +5 - 25% - 15% - x1.66
    +6 - 30% - 20% - x1.50
    +7 - 35% - 25% - x1.40
    +8 - 40% - 30% - x1.33
    +9 - 45% - 35% - x1.28
    +10 - 50% - 40% - x1.25
    +11 - 55% - 45% - x1.22

    So right off the bat enemy mooks like skeleton archers and zombies have their damage cut in half or even thirds. Medium level foes still get a sizeable 30 to 50% increase in survivability and even against stuff as powerful as a CR 11 creature your getting a 20% increase. Note that rings of protection, +1 armour and shields, shield of faith and/or haste being cast on you make it even better.

    On the flip side +1 to crit range is slightly weaker than +1 to hit. A fighter with a greatsword doing 2d6+3 and two hander style does 11.33 damage on average each hit and 20.33 damage each crit.

    This same fighter has a +5 to hit, lets compare this to AC 10 (unarmoured foes). ac 13 (most lightly armour low level foes), ac 16, and ac 18 (very few monsters have more than 18 ac)

    10 ac - Hit 75%, Crit 5% (avg dmg 9.5 per attack)
    13 ac - Hit 60%, Crit 5% (avg dmg 7.8 per attack)
    16 ac - Hit 45%, Crit 5% (avg dmg 6.1 per attack)
    18 ac - Hit 35%, Crit 5% (avg dmg 5.0 per attack)

    Champion gives you +5% crit, given that a 19 is basically always a hit its converting 5% hit into 5% crit. The damage it adds per attack is pretty easy to calculate as it just add 8.33 damage (average dice damage of a greatsword with twohanded style) to one out of 20 attacks for a +.4 damage boost regardless of the targets ac.

    10 ac - 9.5 damage to 9.9 damage - 4% damage buff
    13 ac - 7.8 to 9.2 - 5% damage buff
    16 ac - 6.1 to 6.5 - 6% damage buff
    18 ac - 5.0 to 5.4 - 8% damage buff

    So best case scenario, champion adds 8% damage and worst case scenario (provided you can meet the pretty easy condition) mountaineer adds 20% physical survivability. Mountaineer also has another trait that is very good but hard to evaluate mathematically AND champion actually contributes less the higher your strength and attack values get while mountaineer comparatively gets better with higher ac.
  • Suggestion: Let champions multiply static bonuses on critical hits as well and give them some non-comparable bonus like better climbing and jumping.


  • Class: Wizard
  • Archetype: Green Mage
  • Feature: Warden of the Forest
  • Power: Interestingly weak
  • Feedback: Greenmage is super cool thematically and honestly the extra spells they can cast, leather armour and ranger abilities make them fine balance wise, I just find it a little sad that at level 5+ shooting your bow becomes a trap compared to how much damage your cantrips start doing. It means rather than an arcane archer build you just sorta get an arcane archer phase before you ought to go back to being a classic blasty wizard. although this is sort of an inherited problem from 5e as higher level cantrips begin to eclipse a ton of combat options upto and including 1st level spell slots.
Kalshane
Level 7
Kickstarter Backer
1 month ago

I agree that the Green Mage needs something more. Should probably be longbow and shortbow proficiency (otherwise why not just use a crossbow? The default wizard is supposed to be proficient in light crossbow, though doesn't currently seem to be in the game) and/or extra attack at 6th level.

Daelen
Level 3
1 month ago
  • Class: Fighters
  • Archetype: Fighters in general but less so Spellblade
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: Lack of them
  • Power: Lack of options
  • Feedback: This is a sore spot for 5E in my opinion and an opportunity to give Fighters some interactivity and a good way to give the Archetypes some more nuance. Spellblade is great, gives you a ton of buttons to play with to augment your playstyle (access to Light alone is huge for Humans). I think Champion and Mountaineer and whatever else you have planned should get a button or two to help distinguish their playstyles with actives in addition to their passive bonuses.
  • Suggestion (if any): Each archetype gets one per short rest- Power Attack/Shield Bash/Cleave/Trip/Free Reaction on Falling-Prone enemies etc. Just plunder DnD or Pathfinder for some good ones. 


  • Class: Rogue
  • Archetype: All
  • Feature / Spell / Whatever: Sneak Attack
  • Power: Interface improvement
  • Feedback: Rogues have an unnecessary burden of knowledge compared to other classes in predicting the outcome of their attacks
  • Suggestion (if any): "Sneak Attack!" when you highlight an attack option would be more than enough, it will help the player learn the conditions required for sneak attacking and help make it more fluid rather than having a scenario which looks like it satisfies Sneak conditions but then just doesnt.
Daelen
Level 3
1 month ago

I agree that the Green Mage needs something more. Should probably be longbow and shortbow proficiency (otherwise why not just use a crossbow? The default wizard is supposed to be proficient in light crossbow, though doesn't currently seem to be in the game) and/or extra attack at 6th level.

It has those things its just that you stop using it at 5 when your cantrip levels up. Tough call to fix.. probably best if they add an elemental dice that functions like Sneak Attack or Hunters mark.. or just give them Hunters Mark. 

picklesgrr
Level 8
1 month ago

I agree that the Green Mage needs something more. Should probably be longbow and shortbow proficiency (otherwise why not just use a crossbow? The default wizard is supposed to be proficient in light crossbow, though doesn't currently seem to be in the game) and/or extra attack at 6th level.

It has those things its just that you stop using it at 5 when your cantrip levels up. Tough call to fix.. probably best if they add an elemental dice that functions like Sneak Attack or Hunters mark.. or just give them Hunters Mark. 

They have got hunters mark


Daelen
Level 3
1 month ago

I agree that the Green Mage needs something more. Should probably be longbow and shortbow proficiency (otherwise why not just use a crossbow? The default wizard is supposed to be proficient in light crossbow, though doesn't currently seem to be in the game) and/or extra attack at 6th level.

It has those things its just that you stop using it at 5 when your cantrip levels up. Tough call to fix.. probably best if they add an elemental dice that functions like Sneak Attack or Hunters mark.. or just give them Hunters Mark. 

They have got hunters mark


Im looking at it in game and I guess I just never selected it its not on my list? Maybe should be an auto-know then.

If they have it then that definitely helps but maybe they should still lean into something that stops them from just using cantrips at a certain level and keeps the utility+bow gameplay they seem to be gonig for